So Who's Willing to Wager?

[Kathy_Baratta]

How many of the mentally ill will find their way to the, "Goodbye to Good Mental Health" rally Glenn Beck and God will be holding on the mall in Washington, D.C. this Saturday?

You say you didn't know God was going to be a featured performer along with Saint Sarah? Absolutely according to Beck who has stated (I heard it myself) that he will only be bringing "bullet points" with him and not prepared remarks so as to leave him an empty vessel, as it were, (redundant much      ) so the Lord's holy spirit can overtake him and speak to us through Beck.               (No. I'm not making this up.)

Palin I guess is on her own but we may get lucky and the Virgin Mary may show up on some Moose jerky in Palin's purse. Here's hopin' my faith in the belief that this will be as priceless a memory as it will be worthless as a gesture will come to fruition!      

So. How many wing-nuts will whirl onto the mall for this one? I'm gonna say the crowd will be around 25,000, give or take. No matter what it finally tallies out as, it will at least give us a mean average for how many mentally ill people walk among us.  

KB

[Kathy_Baratta]

I forgot about the Palin MILF factor so that could mean more in attendance (due more in part to hormones than politics.   ).

Conceding that and that Saturday is supposed to be a beautiful day, I still give the final attendance tally at under six figures. (At least I hope so or we are all doomed.  ).

KB

[Pat Garaffa]

I just watched Glenn Beck on John Stossel’s show.  I really think you will be surprised at the attendance tomorrow.  He has an enormous following and I’m sure it will be higher than your guess.  But that also depends who is doing counting – the left or the right.  Glenn Beck will say half a million and CNN and MSNBC will ignore the event or move the decimal to the left and come up with 50K.    

Privatization was the topic of their conversation.  Not all that different than the comical comparison of allowing “profit and efficiency motivated” Wal-Mart to run the “always in the red” Federal government.  John Stossel had estimates that showed it would take almost 3 government employees to do the job of one Haliberton employee due to the inefficiencies.  

This was the best part:  John Stossel had a copy of the government’s recipe for brownies.  I guess they make them from to time and they serve them to the servicemen, government cafeterias and at Blackhawk helicopter fundraisers and bake sales.  

The problem - the recipe was 24 pages long!  Even the size of the nuts had to meet certain standards.  It would take someone all day to make a government brownie and my kid could whip up a batch in 20 minutes for 1/10 the price.    

Multiply the brownie recipe by everything they do and you have a new recipe – a recipe for disaster.  

[Pat Garaffa]

Correction - it's the Pentagon and it's a 26 page recipe - not 24.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=127058298

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/05/25/pentagons-26-page-brownie_n_589149.html

http://consumerist.com/2010/05/defense-department-has-a-26-page-brownie-recipe.html

From one of the 100 or more sites that disuss this silliness:

“Brownies made from the Pentagon’s recipe will probably last about three years if they're packaged properly. But the important question is, how do they taste? We asked Penny Karas, the founder of Hello Cupcake bakery in Washington, D.C., to whip up us a batch. And to be honest, they weren't too good: dry, crumbly and dense.”

Typical government complicated processes that produce something “dry crumbly, and dense"

[Pat Garaffa]

You tweaked your estimates and now it's getting interesting.  It was "under 6 figures" before and now you are down to 25K.  

Martin Luther King Jr, pulled in a quarter million with his "I have a dream speech" and Woodstock did around 450-500K.  Even Simon and Garfunkle brought in half a million when they did their concert in Central Park.  (I was there and I counted them.) 

He has a big following and he is on TV and radio every day.  I have to give Glenn Beck the low end of 6 figures.  

I'll take the bet.  How much are you willing to put up?  

[Thom_Worman]

I agree that Glenn Beck has the right to hold his rally on the same steps where MLK gave his historic speech, I just think he should hold it somewhere that's less offensive to the civil rights movement.

edit: To be fair, Alveda King, MLKs neice, is a speaker at the event... to be even more fair, she's vehemently against Same-Sex rights.

[Pat Garaffa]

Thomas,

Why do you think his rally will be offensive to the civil rights movement?  If anything, I think it will be an extension of the same speech and that first historic speech will probably be mentioned many times.  MLK fought for civil rights and Glenn Beck is fighting for constitutional rights.  Actually, it’s more a restoration of what we had and what has been slowly dismantled over the years.   

The Mosque wants to break ground on 9/11/11 two blocks from ground zero.  I find that insensitive but you didn’t.   But a big fat white guy, speaking on the same steps where a black man made a historical speech, will be offensive?  Even if the topics are similar and the second speech is supportive of the first speech?  I don’t understand?     

My thinking is the opposite.  Black or white they are the same thing and both are fighting for a very similar cause.  And unlike the Mosque, Glenn Beck is willing to condemn those who attacked and killed MLK.  Why can’t the Mosque supporters condemn Islamic extremists? 

Glenn Beck is fighting for a restoration of sanity and an awakening of an apathetic America.  That includes the rights (constitutional, civil, etc) that have been trampled upon by our government. 

Thomas Jefferson and Ben Franklin probably said some odd things too but we didn’t have reporters, DVR’s or Jon Stewart to capture them every time they opened their mouths.  If so, we would have a very different view of our forefathers.  Instead, we documented the smart stuff and swept the drunken tirades under the rug.   

Think about it - what did the internet do to America’s view of George Bush’s reading skills when that doctored picture was passed around after 9/11?  Even though it was false?  The media can create and the media can destroy.  Same thing here. 

Glenn Beck may not be the most eloquent speaker and his snafus often make for late night fodder.  And sometimes his topics make me wonder what he drank before the show.  But you can’t deny that a good percentage of his stuff makes tremendous sense. 

He had MLK 's granddaughter in his show the other day and she endorsed it too.  He has numerous best sellers, a radio show and a TV show every day.  And right or wrong, he has a very large and loyal following.  Louis Farrakhan had a fraction of those credentials yet he pulled in an estimated 800K for his 1995 Million Man March.  If so, there is no reason why Glenn Beck can’t do ¼ of that or more. 

My recession style wager includes 1 Corona with lime and a bowl of pretzels.   

Bueller?  Bueller? 

[Thom_Worman]

(Nathan) Poe's Law has struck you, Pat:

"Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor, it is impossible to create a parody of Fundamentalism that SOMEONE won't mistake for the real thing."

The Mosque wants to break ground on 9/11/11 two blocks from ground zero.  I find that insensitive but you didn’t.  

I'll choose this as my single statement to attack for the day. Park51 is billed as a Community Center designed to welcome people of all faiths... I find it insensitive that you find it insensitive. I suppose I should take all christian interfaith missions to be terrorist flags if Fred Phelps' gang starts murdering Americans?

[Pat Garaffa]

Makes sense.  I would hope we could all communicate without all the winkies, smiles and LOL but it's impossible without a face to face meeting.  I majored in Sarcasm so let it be known.    

I ask again:

"My thinking is the opposite.  Black or white they are the same thing and both are fighting for a very similar cause.  And unlike the Mosque, Glenn Beck is willing to condemn those who attacked and killed MLK.  Why can’t the Mosque supporters condemn Islamic extremists? "

And if it's an Interfaith Community Center then why isn't it called an Interfaith Community Center?  Instead, it's called a Mosque.

I am confident that St. Veronicas would never turn away other faiths either.  Especially if they chose to rent their halls, pray in their pews or enroll in their Boy Scout Troop.  But would they be comfortable doing so?  Would they have supporting materials to assist in their worship?  Would services be altered to accommodate their beliefs?  Do I sit, stand or kneel?  

I doubt it and it's the same thing.  A Christian church may welcome all but they will still primarily support their own Christian beliefs.  Same with other religions.  You may be welcome at a Synagogue but you aren't getting communion.  

There are a few non-denomination churches that support varied Christian beliefs and they welcome Catholics, Methodists, Lutherans, etc.  But ALL religions under the same roof?  Muslims, Christians, Jews, Wiccans?  And what about those non-theists?  Wouldn’t they feel left out?  LOL!  

I would only hope you are right but my years give me doubt.  

 

[Kathy_Baratta]

 

Glenn Beck is fighting for a restoration of sanity and an awakening of an apathetic America.  That includes the rights (constitutional, civil, etc) that have been trampled upon by our government.  

That is such a ludicrous statement I almost ignored it.  Talk about the inmate running the asylum?!
 
And right or wrong, he has a very large and loyal following.  

So did Adolph Hitler. Did you ever watch the footage? The men wanted to be him and the women wanted to be with him. It was all one big, national orgasm.

So what's your point? If it's that the crowd animal will eat whatever is thrown at them then I agree. Those of us with a more discerning palate know when something doesn't pass the smell test.

As to what I am willing to wager? My belief in the possibility of people bettering themselves. Not only through hard work but with compassion for those who only want the same thing. Tomorrow will show whether all's well in my world or we're off to the possibility of a fourth Reich. The people embraced that too.  

KB

P.S. Pay closer attention. I started at an estimated 25K and bumped it to under six figures due to the Palin MILF factor.

[Thom_Worman]

"My thinking is the opposite.  Black or white they are the same thing and both are fighting for a very similar cause.  And unlike the Mosque, Glenn Beck is willing to condemn those who attacked and killed MLK.  Why can’t the Mosque supporters condemn Islamic extremists? "

I support the community center in certain ways and I condemn Islamic Extremists (and christian / and catholic / and hindu / and any theist, and if any existed, any non-theist)

Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf, the financial supporter of the Park51 Project, has spoken at adamantly great length, against islamic extremism, condemning the attacks, and wants to promote americanized, liberal muslim faith. Not sharia law. Not "cut the thief's hands off." Not "Kill the Infidels, their blood is upon them." Not Burqua-Wearing Seen-but-not-heard-walk-20-ft-behind-me women."

He's the kind of guy that Al-Queida wants dead. (Arguably: He's stirring the pot on interfaith relations and combined with the media sensationalism, he's probably doing more harm to said relations and is apparently inciting more hatred toward the muslim faith, something Al-Queso would love to see happen as it strengthens their sentiments.)

And if it's an Interfaith Community Center then why isn't it called an Interfaith Community Center?  Instead, it's called a Mosque.

I said yesterday that it's not called a mosque. It's called "The community center at Park51." But the media doesn't like to call it that because it's not as generalizing and sensationalist as "THE MOSQUE (it isn't) AT GROUND ZERO (it isn't.)"

http://www.park51.org/

There are a few non-denomination churches that support varied Christian beliefs and they welcome Catholics, Methodists, Lutherans, etc.  But ALL religions under the same roof?  Muslims, Christians, Jews, Wiccans?  And what about those non-theists?  Wouldn’t they feel left out?  LOL!  

I think they'd feel just as left out as an Olympic Athlete would at quadriplegic motorized-wheelchair group battery-recharge meeting.

[Pat Garaffa]

"I think they'd feel just as left out as an Olympic Athlete would at quadriplegic motorized-wheelchair group battery-recharge meeting."

I take that as a shot at all organized religion?  LOL!

You've obviously done more homework than I regarding this project and it's supporters.  I won't debate it but I remain skeptical.   

I guess they come in all colors.  There was a guy on the news early this morning and he was a part of a Texan group called "Muslims for Bush".  I assume the ex-president and it had nothing to do with shrubbery.  He even wore a bolo tie!  I had to laugh.

 

[Joe Parente]

Hey, this just in from the Park51 website...

Fundraising Guarantees



We will hire security consultants to assist us in the process of reviewing potential financiers and philanthropists. We will refuse assistance from any persons or institutions who are flagged by our security consultants or any government agencies.



Political Questions


Park51 is not a political organization. We do not have a political agenda, and we will be open to all. We do not have room for extremist views and opinions. Radical and hateful agendas will have no place in our community center or mosque. We are building this center for New York City, because we’re New Yorkers. We have families here and futures here.



On 9/11 (Muslims Attacked)



When our city was attacked on Sept. 11, Muslim New Yorkers were attacked, too. Scores of Muslim Americans perished, both in the attacks and as first responders. Hundreds of Muslims serve in our Police and Fire departments. Many Muslims are fighting alongside their fellow Americans in our armed forces.



Community Concerns



My heart goes out to the families who lost loved ones. We were all attacked that day, no matter what our color or our religion.  Moving forward, I hope and pray the dialogue reaches more New Yorkers and Americans. People have concerns and questions, and we want to answer them in a meaningful way, in a way that lets people know who we really are, what we want to do for the city and how they can be a part of Park51.



I think they're saying the right thing. What do you want them to do Pat, rise up and shout "Kill All Muslims, they're terrorists!"?

[Kathy_Baratta]

 
...Ben Franklin probably said some odd things too but we didn’t have reporters, DVR’s or Jon Stewart to capture them every time they opened their mouths.  If so, we would have a very different view of our forefathers.  Instead, we documented the smart stuff and swept the drunken tirades under the rug.  

Probably so. Just what do you think today's media would do with the fact that old Ben liked to take baths with 14 year-old girls?!

What? Did you think it all started with the press protecting JFK due to "Fiddle" and "Faddle" let alone Marilyn, Judith, Bea, etc."

KB

[Thom_Worman]

"I think they'd feel just as left out as an Olympic Athlete would at quadriplegic motorized-wheelchair group battery-recharge meeting."

I take that as a shot at all organized religion?  LOL!

Yes. An "athlete" doesn't require his "batteries to be charged" on a "weekly basis" to "function," but recognizes their right to gather, establish a common grounds for meeting, attain tax exemptions, influence "wheelchair-ramp accessibility" statutes in persons own personal lives despite the fact they'll never be involved in said lives, convince "wheelchair/rascal/crutch/cane/walkerbound" persons alike to contribute money to said government influences, lecture walking people that they'll never "ride in the gilded eternal wheelchair" and that they'll instead be stuck in a "power wheels car with a dead battery on a hot sidewalk forever," because a "really old operating manual" says so, as interpereted by "Stephen Hawking"  who incidentally initiates job transfers to "Rascal Chair Salesmen" because they were "caught riding" with "children with training wheels on their bicycle."